July 13 2016

Description:

In this first episode of Ask the Avatar (13 July, 2016), Rajiv Malhotra asks Paramahamsa Nithyananda about different topics: they talk about Kumbh mela, it's significance as the core of the Hindu tradition. Rajiv Malhotra asks Swamiji on his views on the revival of Hinduism, standing up for Dharma and protecting Hinduism. Paramahamsa Nithyananda says it is time for the Akhadas to wake up to the truth. Born Hindu's should become practicing Hindu's. Swamiji boldly says that when you bend your body for Surya Namaskar, you are a practicing Hindu. Mr Malhotra asks Swamiji about expressing powers, tells that many people think that Siddhi's will distract you from your path to enlightenment. Swamiji explains how the tradition and structure of Patanajali's teachings is different form Sadashiva's tradition. The Siddhis Patanjali speaks about are not the same as the Shaktis that Sadashiva speaks about. Shaktis, as Sadashiva calls the powers are only expressed from the oneness, never on the path to oneness. Powers expressed from the space of oneness, rooted in oneness, can never lead you astray, they will only establish that state of oneness more and more. Swamiji encourages all his disciples and devotees to express powers and invites everyone who is curious to come and experience them. Watch, share and like the video's and Subscribe to our channel to be notified of the next upload. click http://bit.ly/20j90wr to subscribe. Website and Social Media: http://www.nithyananda.org http://www.nithyananda.tv http://www.innerawakening.org https://twitter.com/SriNithyananda https://www.facebook.com/ParamahamsaNithyananda

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Transcript:

RM: Swamiji it’s an honor to be here. I’ve attended 2 Inner Awakenings. One in Varanasi, including one in Varanasi also and in Bidadi. So I am delighted to be here and meet so many wonderful people. So I wanted to take this opportunity to ask a few questions for our viewers and I would also like to put this up on Facebook page later. Starting with because we are in a sacred place and tomorrow I will be meeting people in the Akhada Parishad, it would be good and important for people to know about the Kumbh Mela, what is it’s history, why we do this because there is so many different ideas people have and coming from you would be the right thing.

nithyānandeśvara samārambhām nithyānandeśvari madhyamām | asmat āchārya paryantām vande guru paramparām ||

I welcome Rajiv first and every one of you.

Swamiji: The story of Kumbh Mela starts from the Samudra Manthan when Milky Ocean was churned and nectar came out, the nectar was protected by Garuda in 4 different places; that 4 different places, that place and the space itself became nectar. So we take the opportunity to go to that place and experience, the Amrita, nectar, immortality within us. Since time immemorial the earliest available Hindu literatures all of them speak about Kumbh Mela not as a beginning— as a happening. Even Vyasa is not speaking about Kumbh Mela; he founded it or he initiated it, or in his time he started it, no. Even he speaks about it as it is happening forever. Even he speaks Kumbh Mela as a tradition. So when it started we can’t tell, but the earliest Puranas, earliest Hindu literatures also speak about Kumbh Mela as a happening, not as if something that they have started, it started a few thousand years before or it started with somebody, no. So the modern day theories that it was started by Adi Shankara and all is not true. It was much, much before Adi Shankara, maybe Adi Shankara organized it, popularized it.

RM: So, even during British times…continue…

Swamiji: Sure you see. There was no time Kumbh Mela was disconnected or stopped. Our Sadhus took care, even if they have given their lives. Sometimes 10,000 sadhus will start; only two hundred will reach the Kumbh Ghat. The remaining all of them will be killed, diverted, arrested, but always that few hundred reached the Kumbh Ghat and did the Holy Snana, observed the tradition, kept it alive.

RM: Very good, very good.

Swamiji: It was unbroken tradition; we gave our lives just to keep this tradition alive.

RM: So Swamiji, related to the Akhadas. So now I would like to know who are the Akhadas, how did they start, what did they do?

Swamiji: Akhadas are basically founded by Sadashiva Himself.

RM: Ok.

Swamiji: All His Ganas, Shiva Ganas, exactly the word ‘Gana’ means – in your length, breadth, depth filled with Shiva you are Shiva Gana. Whoever lives Shiva, they are Shiva Ganas.

All the Shiva Ganas formed the first Akhada. It is directly disciples of Shiva created this Akhadas structure and after Daksha Prajapati was killed, Sadashiva started directly ruling the planet earth through His Shiva Ganas. That is the way the original Akhada structure gets formed. Later on, much later, Kapila Muni organizes Mahanirvani Akhada, then all other Akhadas gets formed. As on now, thirteen Akhadas are accepted widely, as a main stream Akhadas, but there are a many minor Akhadas who are affiliated to these thirteen Akhadas, who work like a sister organization or work like a branch organization. Ideologically they feel connected, but they have their independent identify. So Akhadas formed the core of Hindu tradition, they are the oldest and largest Apex body of Hinduism, as of now at least 10 lakh Sadhus work under the Akhada Parishad, which is the apex body, where all the thirteen Akhadas are member, which is completely a democratic set up.

It is like a all the Thanedars gather together and elect Kothari, all the Kotharis together gather and elect Mahant, all the Mahants together gather and elect the Sri Mahants, all the Sri Mahants together, they gather and elect the Mandaleshwar or Maha Mahamandaleshwar, then Acharya Maha Mahamandaleshwar. So it is like a pure democratic set up and nobody can do things on their own.

RM: So no king came and interfered and said; ‘I will appoint somebody.’

Swamiji: No, no, no. Actually, we appointed Kings many time, because our army went and supported many kings in their wars, we chose their successes.

RM: So Akhadas are also kind of a physical defense?

Swamiji: There was a time Akhadas were not only doing physical defense, they were waging wars for the sake of Dharma and sending armies in support of various kings, Akadha one of their main responsibility is teaching Shaastra, using Astra to protect the Shaastra. Shaastra and Shastra both were the main responsibility of Akadha.

RM: Very good. So sort of like modern commandos in once sense but also intellectual kshatriyas.

Swamiji: I think in the modern day we do not pick up weapon because the war is not actually in the modern day with weapons it is all about intellectual ideas.

RM: Right. Right. So is this Nirvani linked with Buddha's Nirvana idea?

Swamiji: Buddha got initiated in Nirvani Akadha.

RM: In Nirvani Akadha?

Swamiji: Yes. In Nirvani Akadha, you see I can give you 5 points.

The word Sakhya Muni is actually the name of Kapila, Sankhya Muni. So Kapila Maharishi is the founder of Mahanirvani Akadha, Sankhya Muni, Kapila Muni is called Sankhya Muni, so because he took Sannyas from this tradition, Buddha is called Sakhya Muni.

Second; the word nirvana, nirvana, Nirvani Peetha, Nirvani Akhada thousands of years older than Buddhism. Buddha picked up that word from Nirvani Peetha,

and third; this is the, Kashi is the spiritual headquarters of Nirvani Peetha where Kapila Maharishi’s Maha Jeevasamadhi is there, this is where usually Sannyas is given, so Buddha took Sannyas from here and next important thing you need to know – still Mahanirvana's Akhadas 52 Madis, 52 branches, Buddhism is one of the Madi, and still Buddhists receive the respect and recognition as one of the Madi of Nirvani Akhada.

RM: So does Dali Lama accept this?

Swamiji: Yes, yes. All Buddhist accept because it is traditionally and they have to accept. It is not something that started yesterday or the day before yesterday. It is there forever as they as one of the Madis and they do and accept and attend many places. Many ways; the name Nirvani and Sakhya Muni, many of the teachings of Buddha is based on Sankhya Philosophy — and one of the Madi, 52 Madis of Nirvani, Buddhism is one. With all these facts, you can see very clearly, Buddha took the whole structure of Buddhism from Mahanirvana Sampradaya, from Mahanirvani Akhada. It is Mahanirvani Peetha which is the source of Buddhism.

RM: So all this talk about Hindu, Buddhist, difference and clash and conflict….

Swamiji: Surely these are all much later drama to weaken Hinduism. See, all the traditions came out of Sanatana Dharma. In the modern day they are projected as if they are separate just to weaken the Sanatana Hindu Dharma. Otherwise Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism, all of them are from Sanatana Dharma, this is the Source. Even the modern day Hinduism is from Sanatana Dharma.

RM: So what about the property where the 4 Kumbh Melas are held? Is there some special relationship the Akhadas have?

Swamiji: Yes. Till recent periods, all 4 use to be under the control of Mahanirvani. Even now, there are many properties where the Kumbh Mela is held is in the hands of Mahanirvani Peetha and Juna Peetha, these two Peethas even now retain many of the properties as you know a lot of the modern day illegal occupancy all that goes, other than that even now in Allahabad, in Haridwar, in Nasik, and in Ujjain, the major places where the Kumbh Mela happens Akhadas retain huge properties and even those temples; Mahakaleshwar temple used to be under Mahanirvani Peetha completely until recent times, where the Ujjaini Kumbh Mela happened. Very recently government has intervened and even now some kind of a middle arrangement where Mahanirvani Akhada’s representative continues to be a major decision maker, kind of arrangement is done.

RM: So what about Har-ki-pauri?

Swamiji: Har-ki-pauri, other than small bits given to other bigger organization it used to be owned by Mahanirvani Akhada; even now Mahanirvani Akhada has big say in all that land and area. Maybe recently some of the legal complications have raised, other than that, originally used to be under Mahanirvani Akhada.

RM: Its really the Akhadas…

Swamiji: It’s Akhadas conducted, protected the Kumbh Mela and the land where the Kumbh Mela is held; and a one more thing; in the recent days, a lot illegal occupation and different interferences from the political powers, bureaucrats and all that, that took away many of the land holdings. Otherwise, in Haridwar, a major part of Haridwar belongs to Mahnirvani Akhada. So Akhadas were actually the official hosts of Kumbh Mela. I can very comfortably say, without any bias, very comfortably I can say; till the modern government interference Akhadas use to be the host of Kumbh Mela. All the religious, spiritual traditions and the method of conducting, everything was under Akhadas Parishad - means under the Akhadas.

RM: I would like that to be restored. You know a little safe guard it.

Swamiji: And it used to be under Akhadas, even now the major chunk is under Akhadas and as you know the unsaid interferences.

RM: Ya, ya, ya. Secularism and all that.

So Swamiji, now Akhadas have big protectors but now there is a Global Kuruksetra, the game has changed. So now the threats are coming from all over the place. Also, very sleaky. For instance there is a Harvard project to study the Kumbh Mela, but under that pretext of studying, they are looking for opportunities to intervene in the name of human rights, either they are showing gender bias or caste bias, or North-South divide, or environmental pollution going on, or people doing superstitious, primitive things, all kind of stuff like that. So they are calling it ‘data’ and a very dangerous thing is that they are taking a database of attendees of Kumbh Mela and making a database of their mobile numbers; which village district they come from, what caste, where do they belong, which Sampradaya so then they can track these people. So they first use ‘Saam’ and ‘Daam’ to bring them on board and feel like they are helping and ‘data’ will come ‘Bheda’ and ‘Danda’ this is their strategy. So I am studying this and I find that unfortunately there is not much awareness. A lot of people do not want to bother.

Swamiji: I should accept what you said. As Maha Mahamandaleshwar of Mahannirvani Akadha I can speak for me and the people whom I know. We are really not even aware of this Kurukshetra. To tell you honestly, we are in our happy slumber and happy cozy feeling, we get few people touch our feet and have a few bhandaras, and have a little Dakshina, we are happily there, it is unfortunate that still we have not woken up to the reality. I have no right to criticize, comment on anybody, but I can do self-criticism. To tell you honestly, still even I have not woken up to this reality of the intellectual, international Kurukshetra going on. When you explained, I understand the gravity, but we have not woken up to the reality. That is the straightforward honest truth. I will be very sincere, working and trying to share and inspire my colleagues to wake-up to this reality, to wake-up to the war being waged on us, but as of now we have not woken up, that’s the truth.

RM: The beauty is the openness but others can take advantage of it. Too much openness also means we can violated by perpetrators that don’t mean well.

Swamiji: The problem is… actually openness does not need powerlessness, but in the name of openness somewhere we became powerless—and openness does not mean that we need to lose our identity and authenticity, somewhere in the name of openness, we even lost Ishtanishta, the Ishta Nishta, the authenticity is getting diluted. We need to wake up to this reality.

RM: So but, it is very tempting and fashionable to say in the name of Openness, everything is invited. But then conversions can be happening and people can be doing snana and calling it baptism.

Swamiji: See everyone should be invited to celebrate the core tradition…

RM: Our tradition.

Swamiji: which is our tradition, the Hindu tradition. You see Kumbh Mela is the celebration of Hindu tradition, celebration of all the Hindu Sampradayas, celebration of all of the Sanatana Dharma Sampradayas.

So everyone should be invited to celebrate that, not to pollute that. We come to celebrate Ganga not to pollute Ganga. We come to celebrate Sanatana Dharma not to pollute Sanatana Dharma. It’s very unfortunate there are sources, there are plans polluting the Sanatana Dharma, trying to hijack Kumbh Mela, but unfortunately still have not woken-up to the truth. We have not woken up to the truth and still it has not gone into our spine. I don’t know..

19.26

RM: Yea, because partly because of the public relations are so smooth, people feel like they are giving us a gift, like they give us some free food and the average common man is very happy that all these people have come and they are doing this for us, and the risk is the secularization of Kumbh Mela. So one day there might be a Coca Cola tent, their might be a Reliance tent and you know it could become a commercial mela to generate sales because if you have one hundred million people you can sell them a lot of things. So then it becomes not sacred, it just becomes like any other gathering like a anybody can rent a tent and they can do what they want so it could become like that.

Swamiji: That danger is there and it is unfortunate we have not woken-up to that danger. We have not woken-up to that danger and I cannot comment on others, other organization, at least I can tell you as Maha Mandaleshwar of Mahanirvani Peetha, we have not woken up to the danger.

RM: Can certain things be made legally mandated like for instance; non- veg is not going to happen, and no alcohol. Or is it a matter of somebody saying, well this is what I want to do…

Swamiji: Actually it should be done. If you ask my opinion, it should be done—and I will also talk to the Akhadas and insist on bringing these kind of changes by working with government and doing what needed to be done legally and formally in the country. We should bring some of these mandates – it should be no alcohol, no meat zone, so the sanctity is celebrated at least during that period of Kumbh Mela from Peshwai to the last Shahi Snana at least during that period when Dharma Dwaja was raised and till that Dwaja comes down, till that traditionally Dwaja is raised the moment Peshwai happens and only after the last Snana it is brought down and till that Kumbh Mela period at least, we should keep that place dry, means without alcohol and without meat. That’ll maintain the sanctity. There should be even some more mandates like – there should not be any other commercial or secular activities.

RM: Or any other non-Hindu phobic activities because they also want to breach against Hinduism right in the Kumbh Mela.

Swamiji: There are a lot of abusive documentaries made against Naga Sadhus, against Kumbh Mela and showing us as very primitive people, showing us as, in very low understanding.

RM: Like its some exotic circus where people come and enjoy watching these weird people.

Swamiji: And…there was a lot of attack. Unfortunately, even we have not woken up to it.

RM: You know in China, to get a foreign group wants to come and do social research and gather data, they have to apply for a certain research permit and then one of the condition is a copy of whatever data they gathered before they can take it out, they have to deposit it. Now here, research on Kumbh Mela is going on and no authority in this country, Akhadha, or nor government knows what it is. They don’t even know what data is, much less they be able to be ready and argue against it and respond to it. So I think there needs to be some body, some intellectual body protecting the Kumbha Mela, that is vigilant that is doing Purva Paksha on what the others guys are doing and responding to them.

Swamiji: It is the need of the hour of what you are talking, it is need of the hour I think the Akhada Parishad should do this. I surely will recommend to Akhada Parishad and put all of my effort for this to happen. Because, some way Akhada Parishad need to become aware of the war happening. In those days the wars were different (RM: local, visible) local, visible and just with ordinary weapons like with a sword and trishul and all that, but now the war is in a different scale. Still Akhada Parishad we have not woken up.

RM: And what is so sophisticated is one side may not even know war is going on till they are finished.

Swamiji: Actually that is what is happening. We do not even know war is going on till we are finished.

RM: So this intellectual dimension of looking at the other side and examining, responding to them, it needs a different skills set then the Akhadas have. So then they to also have to open up and collaborate with some people who they can trust and have some kind of collaboration.

Swamiji: Only that that, the charcha, Vaakyartha Sadas should go in this direction. See Akhada has a great tradition of sitting as a bunch and discussing and making decisions. It’s a great democratic set up. There, not only the earlier ideas, conversations, debates—now this new debate, new ideas should be brought. Akhadas should be discussing about it. And surely I will do everything which I can, to make this debates happen and put this ideas, make all the Akhadas understand the threat we have.

RM: That is very good. So Swamji I wanted to also going beyond Kumbh Mela, our system is so rich so can you give ideas on health benefits of your teachings, physical, mental, health benefits.

Swamiji: You see, when it comes to the benefits, whether it is the prevention of disease, or maintaining the health, or curing or having the best mental setup - peace, joy or bliss, or ecstasy, and being far away from depression, handling life, everything -- including manifesting the extraordinary powers, everything is available in our original source text, what we call Veda Agama. Vedas and Agamas of this Hindu tradition.

Whatever I am doing is bringing life back, reviving the original science as expressed in Sanatana Hindu Dharma, whatever experience, Anubhuti I had by my Guru's grace, Atma Pramana, I compare with Apta Pramana, Shaastra Pramana, the ancient Master's experiences and I do acid wash all my Atma Pramana with the Apta Pramana. Whatever My personal experience, Atma Pramana, I do acid wash with Shaastra Pramana, Apta Pramana. Whatever finally stands after the acid wash, I share it with the world as Saakshi Pramana, which becomes Saakshi Pramana. I also wanted to tell the whole world, through this opportunity everything you need is available in our shaastras - always learn from the Gurus who have personal Enlightenment and abide by the Shaastra pramana.

(28.08)

Anybody who does not have personal Enlightenment will not even understand the scriptures completely they will be just pundits. They will not be able to give you experience. Some of the people who had a few satori, one or two experience, but does not adhere to Shaastra pramana, there is a danger. That their experience may be good for them not for whole world.

RM: Yes.

Swamiji: Even if somebody is enlightened, what they should share with the world and what they should not share with the world should be, will be decided only by Shaastra Pramana.

Every person - whether he had enlightenment experience or not, what he shares with the world should be decided by Shaastra Pramana. Shaastras gives a complete view of what can be shared and what is good for the whole world. Some of the Gurus by their way, the way they are brought up, they will be vegetarian, they may not be drinking alcohol so they will do some Shirashasana, the stomach cleansing techniques, all this, it’ll work for them, they will have experience, but because they do not refer the original scriptures they don’t understand the vegetarianism and no-alcohol are basic requirement for these kriyas to work. Yama, Niyama are requirements for these other components of Yoga to work. They start thinking this actions alone are enough and they start teaching and when somebody, somebody who drinks regularly alcohol if he does Shirashasana, I guarantee he will have mental problems. I have done enough of research on this.

RM: So it cannot be dismissed as cultural frills?

Swamiji: It cannot be taken out in the name of cultural frills. Everything Patanjali mentions, that is why the word is Ashtanga Yoga, not even 8 steps, 8 parts, anga. The word Ashtanga Yoga is not 8 steps that to get to the second step you leave the first step, to get to the third step you leave the second step, you go to the sixth step you leave all of the other steps, no. It is not steps, it is anga. Unfortunately, some Gurus when they do not read the scripture or respect the scriptures or revere the scripture, the source manuals, they cause more danger to society than the help. So even if somebody is enlightened, what they teach to the world need to be acid washed to the scriptural strength.

RM: So the key is having the experience….

Swamiji: And referring to the and validating with the text, before they tramsmit. See, because many things which we have practiced without even knowing we practiced even that needed to be taught to others. See sometime, for example Ishvara Pranidhāna, Patanjali says: surrendering to the ultimate, we would have practiced it as a simple flow because any child born and brought up in an Indian village tradition learns surrendering to Sadashiva like how he learns to breathe, but we forget when we teach to the world, they may not have had this background and experience they need to be taught this very systematically, scientifically. So even if we are enlightened, even if somebody is enlightened, he has to refer and adhere to the original scriptures when he wants to teach something, when the knowledge needs to be transmitted, that is the only safest way, method the spiritual knowledge, the spiritual experiences, the spiritual enlightenment can be transmitted. I do request the people, please always understand: learn only from the people who have experienced and referring the scriptures.

(33.14)

RM: So all this secularization, dilution is kind of a distortion.

Swamiji: Surely, surely, nothing is a cultural frill in Yoga.

RM: The whole system has to be taken.

Swamiji: The whole thing has to be lived. The whole thing has to be lived. Yoga has not accumulated any cultural frills. Sadashiva is brilliant enough to make a system which keeps itself pure forever, which has self-purification method. Even Ganga is able to purify Herself.

Surely Sadashiva created a system, which keeps itself pure, alive, and nothing can accumulated around Sadashiva’s system.

RM: So a lot of people who call themselves Hindus need to be converted to Hinduism.

Swamiji: They need to start living Hinduism. See they are only born Hindus, but they need to live Hinduism.

RM: Just symbolically, just kind of a name. Now this is where I wanted to discuss, you know, I am studying the whole influence of Indian Dharmic tradition on the West and I want to write a book on this whole thing. It seems that the Buddhists officially and formally accept; hey, I am converting you to be a Buddhist, Dalai Lama did that, but the early Hindu Gurus of the 60’s and 70’s said that the thing is the same that it doesn’t matter - just learn this breathing or learn this asana and you can just continue who you are.

So the people got mixed up, it’s like you have a cup with tea in it, and there is a little tea left and now your pour coffee and you don’t have either one, you have to clean it first, that cleansing and reinstalling for the new Dharma and it didn't happen. So I think a lot of there people have good intentions but do not get rooted. So it seems that there needs to be for people who are outsiders, who is Westerners by birth who want to be genuinely come Hindus there needs to be a procedure where they can be made to feel that they are Hindu, and you will claim that, you will officially call yourself, you will fight the battles of Hinduism and you will just live like that, no matter what anybody says. That way it is good for them. Do you feel that is the case?

(35.44)

Swamiji: You see, it is very unfortunate, people who are living Hindus were not inspired enough to become official Hindus. They are living Hindus; unfortunately, people who don’t have clear root did not guide them to be official Hindus. It is time we open our doors for living Hindus to become official Hindus, doors for living Hindus to become official Hindus.

RM: Very good. This is why what I call the U-turn where people make this U-turn back to their tradition. It does not happen so much with Buddhists. Westerners who are Buddhists they stay, because they have been told now you are a Buddhist and you are part of our Sangha. So we need to do that as Hindus also. Welcome anybody and make sure that they are living the life and give them responsibility as leaders. I think they would want it also.

Swamiji: And, it is time that we open our doors for the people who are living Hindus to become Hindus—and I tell you the moment you bend your body for surya namaskar, you are a living Hindu and even the moment you decide to yoga, yoga means what, it has already 2 presumption – there is Cosmos and you are a Jeeva with multiple life and you have to unite with the Cosmos and reach the Oneness. That is Yoga. So the moment you start practicing yoga, you understand the Oneness, you understand multiple lives, you decide to become One with that Cosmic Oneness. So the basic ideas and truths of Hinduism is part of Yogic Psychology.

RM: Very true.

Swamiji: This cannot be separated, basically the moment you bend to do surya namaskar you are a living Hindu.

RM: So the courage and the clarity required is that certain things are not going to mix like idea of sin, original sin…

Swamiji: In Yogic tradition, there is no idea of original sin.

RM: Yes, that is very important.

Swamiji: There is no idea of original sin. You are Amrtasya putrah. Upanishad very clearly says: shrunvantu vishve amritasya putrāḥ - Oh Sons of immortality, please listen to me…” So, basically our first declaration is shrunvantu vishve amritasya putrāḥ - Oh Sons of immortality.

There is no question of original sin in Yogic tradition or Hindu tradition.

RM: So this whole project that your problem is original sin and your solution is pretty exclusive solution, the whole thing has to be dismantled.

Swamiji: That is not there is Yoga, Hindu tradition. The moment you bend for Yoga, naturally there is no more part of your being.

RM: This is why I was disappointed by somebody who goes to the United Nations and says: Yoga has nothing to do with Hinduism and India because it seems like a bit of making a joke out of it and that’s unfortunate.

Swamiji: No comments.

RM: The next thing that I wanted to discuss is this whole idea of Siddhis.

People are skeptical and afraid of Siddhis. So for instance: Third Eye Awakening even though it is empirically shown, because I feel that they think it is either black magic and something must be wrong or not or they are somewhat uncomfortable with it. I wanted to have your view because I feel Siddhis are basically science, which the ordinary person, which has not yet discovered and a few people have discovered. So if some airplane is flying over some primitive society they will think this is magic a kind of miracle. It is not a miracle to the person who understands. So one quality is that there are knowledgeable people for who it is just a science and it can be taught. Now that is another thing, Sai Baba has Siddhis but He was not teaching others, but you have Siddhis and you are teaching others to have Third Eye Awakening and this idea or the fact that many other kids have Third Eye Awakening and they are free to be measured, evaluated in scientific clinics.

Swamiji: And we are doing everything to make it more and more scientific, means studying. We are encouraging all the studies.

RM: Yes. Because you know it is very interesting to know if different children are having different experiences. So depending on their own level and their conditioning and whatever, somebody sees it from here, somebody sees it from there, somebody can see clairvoyance, distance, somebody else cannot, so the discovery just like scientists, discovering a lot of interesting things but does not fit the old thought and then they find out why it is like this and then pick up the temperature and then they pick up something else. So they are discovering lot of things, now we have to figure out. So this is stage I think we are in, the rediscovery and revalidation of ancient knowledge. Do you feel that is how we should look at siddhis as a science?

Swamiji: I’ll present the basic few truths.

People have, a few stupid fellows who think it is not possible, then they are too stupid, that is one group.

Second: kind of a paranoid that it is stopping our growth towards Enlightenment, which is not true.

I wanted this important truth to be understood: Patanjali speaks Siddhis as destruction for Enlightenment because the methodology he provides is – when you are travelling towards Enlightenment you will manifest these powers – that is the science based on what Patanjali is offering.

There is one more science by Sadashiva much before Patanjali called Sashtanga yoga in Yoga Pada, there Siddhis manifest from the space of Oneness. They do not manifest on the way to Enlightenment. So Sadashiva calls them as Shaktis not siddhis. So the science I am following is from the Yoga Pada of Sadashiva. The more you experience Oneness and enlightenment the more you will experience powers.

What I am presenting to the world is not siddhis as described by Patanjali it is Shaktis as described by Sadashiva.

RM: That’s very good.

Swamiji: Sadashiva gives a structure called Sashtanga Yoga; Patanjali gives a structure called Ashtanga yoga, both lead to enlightenment. Sadashiva has delivered it in Agama 60,000 years before. Patanjali is actually a disciple of Sadashiva, he delivers it the way he understood and the way his generation needed it, when he lived what was the need of the people, for them he delivered it. So what I am offering to the world, whether my kids doing – Third Eye reading, or they are able to see what is happening somewhere, even thousands of kilometers away, I think you can have your own personal experience.

RM: Ya, he told many things, ya correctly.

Swamiji: (laughs) and seeing beyond the distance, all this are not siddhis as described in Patanjali Yoga Sutra by Patanjali, they are Shaktis as described by Sadashiva in Sashtanga Yoga in Agamas, Yoga Pada.

In Agamas, Yoga Pada, Sadashiva very clearly describes. So these Shaktis do not stop somebody reaching enlightenment and they manifest only if that person is rooted in the enlightened state.

See for example: if you ask a person who does third-eye reading from Patanjali tradition, he will say he concentrates himself and completely centers, does pratyahara, dharana and then he manifests that power, but if you ask My disciple how he is manifesting the power, all he will say is he goes to that Oneness, that Oneness is manifesting that power. There is no concentration, there is no meditation, dharana, dhyana, samadhi has a different meaning in Sashtanga then the meaning in ashtanga.

RM: Very good.

Swamiji: The tradition I am following, I have been taught by My Gurus is the tradition of Sadashiva’s Agamas. It is based on Upanishads, practiced as Agama. So the whole idea is different.

It is not siddhi it is Shakti;

and it is not before enlightenment it is after enlightenment.

It is not towards the Oneness it is from Oneness.

It is not of enlightenment it is from enlightenment.

That is the major difference. That is what.

Second: when we do not analyze the Shaastras thoroughly, many Gurus criticize My initiating people into healing, they do even openly declare healing should not be done, these powers should not be manifested, and some Gurus even openly declare when they are asked about third-eye, for God’s sake don't try to open it. I do not know what is the reason and what is the context, and I have nothing to comment, but one thing I can be sure, whatever I am saying now, I am responsible.

What I am teaching is from original Agamas, Yoga Pada, the science very clearly declares Sadashiva, Sadashiva is very clear: manifestation of these powers happen when you experience Oneness with Sadashiva not on the way to experience Oneness with Sadashiva.

Patanjali declares all these siddhis are experienced on the way to Nirvakalpa Samadhi so they can be distraction to Nirvakalpa Samadhi.

Sadashiva very clearly declares these are manifesting in His tradition. You see, each tradition has a structure, separate architecture, separate architecture, you may be surprised in Sashtanga, Sadashiva talks about different ways and He explains the pranayama, pratyahara in a totally different context. So the whole structure is different. There He says very clearly – these powers start manifesting from experience of Oneness, means after the Nirvakalpa Samadhi they start manifesting.

RM: Patanjali system became more popular at least now a days.

Swamiji: Patanjali systems became popular, Sadashiva’s system did not become popular because for various reasons, because the Sadashiva’s system needs somebody who is grounded in that. It comes more with the Guru-disciple parampara.

Patanjali you can just pick up a book off the shelf, you do not need a Guru, you do not need a Sanskrit, you can be very proud that you do not know the Sanskrit language and it can be easily hijacked.

But the Sadashiva’s system needs a basic requirement of initiation by enlightened Guru. Shaktipat, Shaktipat, initiation and training by and enlightened Master, so naturally the requirements and pre-requisites of this tradition did not allow this tradition to be mass circulated.

RM: which is very good actually, it protects it.

Swamiji: Good or bad that is one, this is the reality, this is the reality. But just because Patanjali’s system has become popular, no one has a right to say other than that no other thought current exists and anybody who manifests these extraordinary powers is only expressing siddhis and that will distract people from enlightenment. The whole thing is irrelevant when you are in the path of Sadashivas; as per Yoga Pada of Agama, because here whatever is manifested; there is no concentration or any mind game used, it is from the Oneness expressed, they are not siddhis they are Shaktis.

And I also want to assure all My disciples and followers: express, manifest as many powers as Mahadeva describes, you will not be deviated from the Enlightenment, you will be more and more rooted in the Oneness experience. You do not need to have the worries generated by Patanjalas, you are Adi Shaivas.

A lot of confusions about siddhis is because of Patanjalas, the followers of Patanjali—and unfortunately, even in the system of Patanjali they have not reached the Nirvakalpa Samadhi so they are not able to understand some other traditions exist, some other possibilities exist.

See Sadashiva very clearly says: every pattern you complete and achieve completion, manifests as one power, Shakti, playing with that Shakti, manifesting that Shakti does not take you away from enlightenment, it grounds you more and more in Oneness.

Manifesting and playing with the power itself becomes a spiritual practice to be grounded in Oneness in Sadashiva’s tradition.

Anybody who is willing to challenge Me as per this tradition I am ready to face them for Vaakyartha Sadas or Khandana-Mandana or Vaada-prativaada. I am open and I will also demonstrate this siddhis and prove to them they are not siddhis as per Patanjali. They are pure Shaktis as per Sadashiva.

See there is a big difference – when somebody expressed Siddhis as per Patanjali his brain will not show turiya state, the ultimate awareness and ultimate restfulness. I can demonstrate the siddhis, not only through me, through any of My disciples, not only will they manifest siddhis, their brain will be in the same frequency of ultimate restful awareness and ultimate awareness, which is turiya, the Oneness state.

RM: So neuroscience should do some brain scan, work on these students….

Swamiji: …which we are already doing, which we already started.

RM: they should be published in scientific journals, because that is very solid proof.

(53.11)

Swamiji: See, when somebody is in the state of the ultimate awareness and ultimate rest that can be clearly recorded by the modern day equipments, which we have tried many times and it shows very clearly that no thought, turiya state. Whenever My disciples manifest powers it always shows the brain is in the turiya state. It means it is not siddhi it is a Shakti. They are manifesting Oneness. They are not having these powers towards Oneness; they are having these powers because they are rooted in Oneness.

RM: To me, the 2 most amazing things I am learning from you.

One is this: the human potential, the higher human potential than what ordinary people have discovered, higher than what science has discovered…

Swamiji: And I also wanted to tell you, if anybody is honestly open to know about these powers, I am open to share with them the science and Sadashiva’s science, and I have no copyright. I am very clear, I am very clear I have realized whatever Sadashiva has said and I have experienced My contribution is only reinvention not discovery. I have reinvented whatever Sadashiva shared. So it belongs to whole world, whole universe, anybody who is interested I am open for them to take it, practice it, enjoy it and share it with the world, not to distort it.

(55. 05)

RM: That’s very wonderful. So I think that this in itself is an amazing achievement and the other one is the Kumbh Mela and the Akhadas collecting them and making it protected, bringing awareness so that, because I feel that the earlier part of our discussion about the Kumbh Mela. I feel that with a properly protected Kumbh Mela you can use that as reviver of all Hinduism and this is why it has been targeted for attack, because if they can attack that, they can attack all of Hinduism. They know that, that is the center. So these 2 things, from the oldest tradition of the Kumbh Mela and bring it to the modern times and the oldest tradition of the Shiva Sutras and Agamas and bringing that to modern Shakti.

Swamiji: Shiva Sutras, Vijñāna Bhairava Tantra, Spanda Karika are all part of the same Shaiva Agamas. Shiva has delivered 108 Agamas. 28 is popular in South, 64 is popular in North.

RM: I need to come and study more with you. I have started some of my studies with the works of Lakshman Joo.

Swamiji: All the Kashmiri Shaivate works are from Shiva Agamas.

RM: Yes, yes, yes. Kashmir Shaivism, very…

Swamiji: There are various branches of Shaivaism - Vira Shaivam, AdiShaivam, the Kashmir Shaivism and Lakulishwara’s Shaivism, Pashupata Shaivism, all these various branches of Shaivaism are from the same root Adi Shaivaism or the Agamas, because each of this branch calls their original scripture as Agamas and they have Sadashiva as the Source. See all traditions which declare Sadashiva as Source I call as Shaivaite tradition.

RM: Swamiji I am glad that neither Max Mueller translated because that could have been distorted nor this new Murthi Classic Library translation by Sheldon Pollock has targeted those texts, which means they have ignored people who are authentic can control them and translate them properly otherwise it would all be misinformation. So in a sense being ignored and left alone is a blessing in disguise because then it is not distorted and a true teacher can come in and….

Swamiji: And I also wanted to invit… see there are many Gurus are criticizing indirectly that what I am teaching is Siddhis, some of them don’t even accept they even say it bogus. Some of them genuinely say – no, it is siddhis, because it is so undeniable, but it is blocking the enlightenment or diverting people from enlightenment.

I wanted to sincerely request them – if you are interested in attacking Me go ahead, do that I have no problem, I have seen enough and I don't care. But if you are sincerely believing it, and want the truth, now I am sharing it. What I am doing is not siddhi it is Shakti, it is being established in Oneness.

What you know from Patanjali and what is from Sadashiva is totally different. I am not saying Patanjali’s structure is inferior, no, that is the structure. In his structure powers manifest when you are towards enlightenment. In Sadashiva’s structure powers manifest when you are from Oneness. So what we practice here are not siddhis they are Shaktis, totally different. So, if those Gurus are really interested I am open, available for them. They can see what is happening here.

RM: Maybe I will go and propose that we should have to have some kind of a mela or gathering or discussion or something…

Swamiji: I am verily open, available for it.

RM: I will propose that. This is absolutely amazing opportunity for me to clarity for myself and those people who follow me and discuss with me this kind of knowledge. Lot of…

Swamiji: And I also wanted them to know, I am responsible for My disciples enlightenment. I will never do anything, which puts that in jeopardy. I’ll never do anything, which puts that in jeopardy, so when I am helping them to manifest these powers, they can be rest assured they are manifesting Shaktis not siddhis.

RM: Excellent.

Swamiji: So they do not need to worry the traditions of Patanjali and they need to be very clear and free that they are following Sadashiva.

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